Windstar Recall!!

kaviation · 09-07-2011, 03:28 AM

Hello,

New member here.

I am one of thousands affected by the front sub-frame recall, the right front control arm seperated from the subframe causing the wheel to basically fall off pulling out the axle. My wife was driving it at the time, but thank god she was in a parking lot.

It's "fixed" (i use that term loosely) for now. My concern is that Ford won't replace the sub-frame, and instead of welding a new control arm mounting bracket in place, they EPOXY it in place, using a metal bonding adhesive. I find this unacceptable!! I understand the brackets (upper and lower) that they install wrap around this, but I don't believe this should be allowed.

I asked the service man who performed the recall repairs, how long will that last? His response was "How long do you intend on keeping it"!!!! I said what the hell does that matter. Obviously this is not a time tested repair, so FORD has no clue how these will hold up in the future. I did some research on this adhesive (TA-1-B) they use, made by LORD Corp. I find no study/evidence that this is approved for use on any suspension part! I did find out that it is used in conjuction with spot welding on the A-pillars, and on body panels!!

Can anybody tell me if there is proof that this is an APPROVED adhesive for a suspension piece? I highly doubt it!

TIA

White Cloud · 09-07-2011, 02:01 PM

I have a 2001 Windstar that was recalled and they claim it was repaired with in 500 miles started hearing noises (rattling) sounded like side sliding door, nothing found, then rear passenger shock bad so replaced rear shocks but not it either, was told that it was rear windshield wiper motor assembly loose took the panel off everything tight although it doesn't work. Told that its the rear brakes within the drums that something is broken and rattling around. Well there original but I would think there would be a grinding noise if that were so but this is a loud rattling noise. I've looked under the vehicle and can't see anything in exhaust system or even the rear axle assembly that looks broken or has been repaired, maybe I don't know what I'm looking at. Took it to dealer when we first heard noise they said they looked at it and nothing wrong with repair made. Anybody else have same noise.............after repair...?

kaviation · 09-08-2011, 01:45 PM

Are there any Ford techs on here that may be able to answer this?

mark v · 09-09-2011, 01:24 PM

Ford went through a lot of engineering so I am guessing if it is done correct it will hold.

Epoxys made now are 1000's of times better than they were years ago.

kaviation · 09-30-2011, 07:03 PM

I did a little more digging. I called the LORD Corp. (which manufactures several adhesives as well as the one used on the Windstar recalls). I talked to a rep. who helped formulate the very epoxy they use in these recalls. When I told him how Ford used the epoxy to "GLUE" my control arm bracket back on the subframe, he said that "That epoxy was never meant to be used in high stress areas or where seperation has occured: Meaning that this is a BOGUS fix that Ford is cheaping out on, leaving the safety of it's consumers to take on the potential risks.!! I tried calling corporate H.Q. but they never returned my call. If they don't do something else here, I'll plaster this story all over the local news, then call ABC news, (since they already did a story on the rear axle recall). I plan on getting rid of this P.O.S., (never any Ford agan) and I hope anyone that has one can do the same. thing. I'm sure the repair would last for a little while, but it's still NOT RIGHT!!!

mark v · 10-04-2011, 12:59 PM

What car will you buy then? Every MFG has done some type of failure by going cheap, you will never avoid this.

Graybeard · 10-04-2011, 01:08 PM

He'll no doubt buy a Toyota - Moving Forward, even when you don't want to..

mark v · 10-04-2011, 01:11 PM

People would be walking everywhere if they didn't want to get screwed by an auto MFG, however then they would be getting screwed by Shoe makers then!

Ahhh.... life goes on.

kaviation · 10-04-2011, 03:46 PM

Originally Posted by mark v

People would be walking everywhere if they didn't want to get screwed by an auto MFG, however then they would be getting screwed by Shoe makers then!

Ahhh.... life goes on.

Unfortunately you are correct.! It's a shame that everything we buy is junk! No matter what it is, how much money you spend, things just aren't made the same. Manufactures pump out as much as they can so they they can sell the most, then quality suffers.

My beef is that, Ford used an epoxy in a repair that in no way, was designed for. When Toyota truck frames were rotting away, they didn't put a band-aid over it, they replaced the WHOLE FRAME! That's a company that stands by their consumer. Would any of you feel safe putting your family in a van where they used the wrong processes to fix it?

My Windstar has been a money pit for a few years now, but I understand things go wrong, when suspension/wheels start falling off, that's a different story. I have the dreaded battery draining issue. Don't have the time/money to waste on guessing which modlule it could be. it's intermittant, It dies when ever it feels like it, usually when my wife and kids are using it.

I could see if it was 15-20 years old, maybe. I went to 3 different auto shops that perform inspections, ALL 3 SAID THEY WOULD FAIL THIS VAN KNOWING WHAT HAPPENED. Basically I have a useless Windstar.

I talked to an executive the other day. I informed her of all my findings. She knew none of this. I asked her if they would consider re-instating the buy back deal. She said they could not do that, I then told her that I would be contacting the local news media about this. I have an appointment next week with them. I know severa people that are tossing their vans as well because they too are having trouble with the repair.

It's a shame because I really like the new line-up Ford has, but I just can't take that gamble again. Sour tastes linger for a while.

mark v · 10-04-2011, 03:57 PM

Toyota also hid their defects and got caught. The Government made them recall, Ford volunteered the recall.

GM is the worst of all, I bet you never heard about this story.... History of the GM Side Saddle Gas Tank Defect | The Center for Autosafety GM figured it would be cheaper to pay off Lawsuits for deaths than correct the problem of a $2.20 part.

kaviation · 10-04-2011, 10:19 PM

Originally Posted by mark v

Toyota also hid their defects and got caught. The Government made them recall, Ford volunteered the recall.

GM is the worst of all, I bet you never heard about this story.... History of the GM Side Saddle Gas Tank Defect | The Center for Autosafety GM figured it would be cheaper to pay off Lawsuits for deaths than correct the problem of a $2.20 part.

That's just plain disturbing!!! It's a damn shame people like that don't have any morals. They need to go jail! 1800 people!!! That's mass murder!

kaviation · 10-05-2011, 07:33 PM

Here are the pics I took the day it happened, so you can have a better idea of what happened.

mark v · 10-06-2011, 01:06 PM

DAMN! that does not look repairable to me.

juiced71 · 10-14-2011, 04:46 AM

yeah i would want my family and kids ridding in that! everytime i took a family vaction and i hit the highway at 70mph i sure wouldn't feel safe! i cant believe the dealer would glue a suspension part and one of the most important ones at that! that is a half ass repair! hows the alignment? i would go to another dealer and let them know you dont feel safe driving this vechicle , if they cant help you then get fords main number!
im sure there are inspection machanics on here, ask them if your car came in with glued suspension parts would it pass inspection? im sure ford can do something it would a lot cheaper for them to fix it right or buy the van back then for you to sue them!
ford did right by me! i had a problem with mine,took it in they took pictures and sent them to ford and ford came back and bought it back 6 hours later! gave me a rental until the check came in..and i thank ford!

kaviation · 10-16-2011, 02:53 PM

Originally Posted by juiced71

yeah i would want my family and kids ridding in that! everytime i took a family vaction and i hit the highway at 70mph i sure wouldn't feel safe! i cant believe the dealer would glue a suspension part and one of the most important ones at that! that is a half ass repair! hows the alignment? i would go to another dealer and let them know you dont feel safe driving this vechicle , if they cant help you then get fords main number!
im sure there are inspection machanics on here, ask them if your car came in with glued suspension parts would it pass inspection? im sure ford can do something it would a lot cheaper for them to fix it right or buy the van back then for you to sue them!
ford did right by me! i had a problem with mine,took it in they took pictures and sent them to ford and ford came back and bought it back 6 hours later! gave me a rental until the check came in..and i thank ford!

Ford did for you and several others what they should have done to all Windstar owners, BOUGHT IT OFF OF YOU! I'm glad you were not forced to keep something unsafe. I talked to 3 independent shops, and they said that knowing that it had seperated, they WOULD NOT PASS MY VAN FOR INSPECTION! I'm sure a Ford dealer would pass it, but no one else would sign their name to that sticker!

I talked to one of Fords' exec's and she "understood" my problem, but she couldn't get them to buy mine back. I told her you friggen own the company! Don't sit there and tell me you CAN'T buy my van back, you people can do what ever the hell you want, I laughed at her when she said that!

Then I really laughed hard when she called me back and told me she talked to the service manager at the dealer who performed the repair, he told her that the repair was perfectly safe.. Ha, ha, I asked her if he was an engineer, and if he knew that the adhesive used was NOT DESIGNED for this application? Then she tried to offer me an employee discount on a new Ford vehicle. I told her to kiss my A**! If you won't buy my van back, to hell with you, why would I give you A-holes my business ever again. I already turned about 15 people away from Ford, and they have told people they know too. I have it all over Facebook, and other internet forums. Hell, I'm happy with just turning 1 person away from them.

The battery "drained" on my wife once again about 2 weeks ago (for the 16 time in a year), that's when I had enough, I traded it in, got 4 grand for it, and said ciao P.O.S. Only down-side is now I have another payment, but oh well that's life!

juiced71 · 10-19-2011, 03:16 AM

very strange ! if local shops wont pass if for inspection then id say thats a problem, welp its someone elses problem now,and when something happens and that van veers off the road and hits something its documented that ford did the repair .....
i think i would have called the state police and had them look it over...
well good luck with your new ride as the same!

Graybeard · 10-19-2011, 05:21 AM

To protect yourself, do you have a written record that repair was performed by a Ford dealer, and not you?

kaviation · 10-20-2011, 12:18 PM

Originally Posted by Graybeard

To protect yourself, do you have a written record that repair was performed by a Ford dealer, and not you?

Yes Graybeard, I have all documented paperwork. Plus if anyone searches the VIN It will be noted about the recall, and as with most recalls, the manufacture will always be responsible for it, unless it had been repaired BEFORE the recall went public by another shop.