Another transmission upgrade inquiry (AOD/AODE)

Drew0569 · 06-22-2010, 11:40 AM

To begin with, my '79 Fairmont has a 200 ci six-banger and its C4 transmission could use some work that would cost more than an upgrade to an AOD (especially if I source a used AOD) OR maybe an AODE. Okay, maybe the reality is that I'm looking for an EXCUSE to upgrade to an AOD or AODE. Naturally, this leads to some questions (please keep in mind that the main reason I'm even staying with the automatic is to keep the car wife-friendly... I may upgrade it to weekend .25-mile duty in the distant future):
Fitment: will both transmissions fit without any alterations to the transmission tunnel (I just want to know... not a crybaby here... I can modify the tunnel if it comes to it)?
Crossmember: if the donor car is also a fox-chassis car (AOD), will the crossmember from the donor car work? Would the original crossmember for the AODE work?
Advantages: how does the AOD compare to the AODE? I understand that the AOD would be cheaper (considering, for starters, that installation of the AODE would call for a stand-alone controller such as the one from Baumann Electronic Controls for $400 in addition to the $150 wiring harness). On the other hand, I read that the AODE has a hollow shaft-within-a-shaft input shaft arrangement. Does this make it a weakling?
Bellhousing: would either transmission bolt up to my C4's bellhousing, or will I pretty much have to do the upgrade to a 5.0 at the same time (that would be a shame... sort of)?
Any help will most certainly be appreciated.

VAMP_77 · 06-22-2010, 11:46 AM

Only help i can give ya is from my '89 bronco...AOD suxs if ya beat on it like i do....*then again, AOD+4LO+blown front hubs+ 4,000rpm on the highway= BOOM!

You're talking about later on being a 1/4mile car... IMHO i'd go after the AODE, so u can 'turn off' the overdrive when u plan to beat on it.(see above* ) But i dont know trannys as well.. uhm... ask Jonzo

Drew0569 · 06-22-2010, 12:04 PM

Oh, Yeah. I probably should've mentioned that I've done some searching and have found a AOD for $150 with torque converter from a Lincoln Mark VII with a claimed 7k miles since rebuild (and yes, I know the that the AOD from the Mark VII is about an inch longer than the Mustang AOD, but this sounds like one heck of a deal). On the other hand, I found an AODE for $200 from a '94-'95 Mustang with 90k miles on it (I haven't gotten in touch yet with the person who posted the advertisement).
That longer tailshaft on the AOD brings me to another question: if I get the AOD instead of the AODE, would it be better for it to have a shorter tailshaft (longer driveshaft) later on down the road when I make the car a part-time quarter-miler?

Dominick · 06-22-2010, 12:13 PM

In my opinion which doesn't mean much.
The shorter ouput shaft would be better cos of breakage.
Some Trucks 4X4's use the shorter shaft. .
If you go to the AODE make sure you get a good contoller.
Every one I drove shifted like mush.

Drew0569 · 06-22-2010, 12:42 PM

Dominick-
Were the AODE-equipped cars you've driven originally equipped with AODE's? I only ask because, if that's the case, it's likely that the mush was actually in the programming from the factory. Ford tends to do that so that their products have more mass appeal and, therefore, more sales to the masses.
Baumann Engineering claims that the Baumannator TCS (in conjunction with their valve body) provides complete control and tuneability of the transmission. It sounds pretty promising.
There apparently are other standalone controllers out there for the AODE. I found two using yahoo! advanced web search. A quick check of the others (I haven't checked them out yet in any detail) shows that they cost $900 plus whereas the Baumannator TCS and wiring harness cost $550 together and the valve body recalibration kit costs another $59.95.

Dominick · 06-22-2010, 01:03 PM

Yes the ones I drove were factory and were computer shifted.
The one I have in my old 91 is AOD shifts great.
But I agree with you one the ease of shifting on the on the AODE for customer appeal.

Jonzo77 · 06-22-2010, 04:51 PM

the AOD will not bolt onto the inline 6. the bell mounting surface on the AOD matches the larger V8 bell. you will have to either go with the 3.8 V6, or the V8 to get an AOD in...

ZephyrEFI · 06-22-2010, 07:52 PM

Originally Posted by Drew0569

Fitment: will both transmissions fit without any alterations to the transmission tunnel (I just want to know... not a crybaby here... I can modify the tunnel if it comes to it)?
Crossmember: if the donor car is also a fox-chassis car (AOD), will the crossmember from the donor car work? Would the original crossmember for the AODE work?

YES, I have one in my car. No alteration of the tunnel.

The crossmember brakets on the body don't line up with the AOD tranny mount. You'll need to invent a way to bolt it up. It's do-able, but you may find it not worth the trouble. If your car was an '83, it would be a different story.

Drew0569 · 06-22-2010, 08:14 PM

Thank you all for the help so far. It looks like we're down to one question: does either one really have any advantage over the other (though Vamp 77 did bring up the very pertinent point that the overdrive can be turned off with the AODE)? Anybody else have any good answers to the question?

Ashzo77 · 06-22-2010, 08:18 PM

why would you turn the OD off? you get better fuel mileage with it on. plus you get a way better passing gear with it...

Feared_Futura · 06-22-2010, 08:31 PM

if you pound on a trans like at the strip you turn the OD off to (depending on the vehicle) change your shifting points, or to keep it from trying to shift into overdrive so the vehicle can pull harder through 3 gear.

Feared_Futura · 06-22-2010, 08:35 PM

Originally Posted by Jonzo77

the AOD will not bolt onto the inline 6. the bell mounting surface on the AOD matches the larger V8 bell. you will have to either go with the 3.8 V6, or the V8 to get an AOD in...

i'm not going to go against what you say since you probably have more experience but the first time the trans went out in my 'mont i got a used trans and i didn't know at the time it was an AOD but it was and it had a detachable bell housing. On the other hand the AOD i have in my garage out of an 86 bronco does not have the detachable bell housing.

Drew0569 · 06-23-2010, 08:02 PM

And now on to a very related question...
I had thought that it was pretty much a given that bucket seats were required when going to a floor-mounted shifter, but a video embedded in a reply by Jonzo 77 in the

Pros and cons of using a chevy small block thread shows a bench seat and it doesn't look to me like the seat is of the notched variety (if you haven't seen the video, you can check it out at

YouTube - Worlds quickest STOCK LS based Motor

... as much as part of me doesn't agree with the choice of powerplant, this video rocks!).
I figure that it's a given that the shifter is cable-operated, which allows a little flexibility in the placement of the shifter.
Now the redundant question: did I miss something, or is that a plain bench seat and a cable-operated floor shifter? If yes, that could save me some money and allow me to put off the changeover to bucket seats!

Soopernaut · 06-24-2010, 11:18 AM

Originally Posted by Drew0569

Now the redundant question: did I miss something, or is that a plain bench seat and a cable-operated floor shifter? If yes, that could save me some money and allow me to put off the changeover to bucket seats!

It appears to be a plain bench and a floor shifter so it appears do-able. You could also modify the shifter arm if it hits the seat.

Drew0569 · 07-10-2010, 08:15 AM

It kinda looks like I'll be putting in an AOD and upgrading to the AODE later. In the meantime, I would like to know which donors I can get the AODE from when the time comes. The best information I have says that the bellhousing on the AOD and AODE are integral to the case and, therefore, the correct donor is essential.
First in line is the '95-'95 Mustang with the 5.0 liter. This one is a known fit. Does the 3.8 liter engine have the same bellhousing pattern? If the bellhousing IS the same, is the transmission geared the same?
Next up is the F-series pickup with the 5.0 liter or 5.8 liter engine. Did Ford gear all of the AODE's the same, or do the ones in the trucks have different gearing?
These are the only donors I've been able to identify. Everything else seems to have 4.6 liter engines and, therefore, the wrong bellhousing pattern. Am I wrong? Thank you all.

UPDATE: I did a bit more homework and found myself referring to a link to a transmission spotters guide in the reference thread posted by Stymee. It seems that the trucks DID use different ratios. It also seems that, even if the AODE from a 3.8 liter has the same bellhousing bolt pattern, it IS internally different (they have one less clutch plate than the car's equipped with V-8's). So it seems that, unless some of this information isn't exactly correct, my only real choice of donor cars is a '94 Mustang with a 5.0 or a '95 Mustang with a 5.0. Reality bites.

just_ed · 07-10-2010, 09:59 AM

they are both good transmissions if built properly... but the aode downfall extra cost on the controller

Dominick · 07-10-2010, 12:37 PM

I think if you go to a trans shop and ask them about the clutch drum being different.
They could tell you.
I know that sometimes they put a extra steel plate in them to make them fit or even the thicknessof the snap ring that holds the clutch pack in.
thats the reason went you look up the clutches they say as required more for the v-8 less for the 6
I hope this made sense.

Ashzo77 · 07-10-2010, 02:14 PM

Originally Posted by Feared_Futura

i'm not going to go against what you say since you probably have more experience but the first time the trans went out in my 'mont i got a used trans and i didn't know at the time it was an AOD but it was and it had a detachable bell housing. On the other hand the AOD i have in my garage out of an 86 bronco does not have the detachable bell housing.

the c4 that came with the 200 is different from the one that came with the V8. the case is smaller on the 200's as well as the dipstick goes to the case, not the pan like the V8. the backside of the bell (bell to trans) is a different size as well. that's what jonzo was talking about...

Stymees'mont · 07-12-2010, 06:12 PM

Originally Posted by Ashzo77

the c4 that came with the 200 is different from the one that came with the V8. the case is smaller on the 200's as well as the dipstick goes to the case, not the pan like the V8. the backside of the bell (bell to trans) is a different size as well. that's what jonzo was talking about...

Not totally true, My C-4 was on a 351w and it has the dipstick in the pan. I still have it on my new 351w. The tranny and 351w I took out of full size Thunderbird about a '77 if I remember.

Ashzo77 · 07-13-2010, 09:18 AM

Originally Posted by Stymees'mont

Not totally true, My C-4 was on a 351w and it has the dipstick in the pan. I still have it on my new 351w. The tranny and 351w I took out of full size Thunderbird about a '77 if I remember.

you just said the same thing i did eric, lol.

what about the AOD from the 4 cylinder?