[Cardriver333]

Hi all, I just started working on a 1966 I6 Mustang. I'm trying to get it started, but my current roadblock is I don't think my flywheel and bellhousing are compatible (details below).

My question is should I replace the necessary parts or fabricate a bracket and find a starter with the right gearing to attach to it?

After a little research it looks like my bell housing (C5DA-6394-A) belongs to a 289 ci mustang and needs a 157 tooth flywheel, the 164 tooth flywheel (C5AE-E or C7AE-A) goes to a few different cars from that era, and the engine looks like a 69 I6 200 ci thriftpower which I think is exactly what is supposed to be in the car, but the numbers on the block say it came from a falcon.

I'm learning as I go so I'm definitely open to any suggestions.

 

[Action]

Welcome to the FFO!

To confirm, you have a 1969 200 six in your 1966 Mustang?
And which transmission?

Just so you know the numbers you posted are engineering numbers. Not part numbers. It is a Ford thing.
Without knowing much, a service part number will have the letter Z in the 4th position

Action

 

[Cardriver333]

Thanks for the welcome! Yes, it is a 66 that has a 69 falcon engine in it (which i believe is pretty much the same as what belongs in the car). My transmission is missing the ID plate on the passenger side, but stamped into the driver side is C5AR-7006 B. It is a manual 3 speed on the floor.

 

[Action]

There are two 200 six cylinder bell housing patterns
When everything is connected, they are identified by starter position. High mount and low mount.
Low mount was created in the 65/66 time frame and later that will also accept Windsor V8 transmissions.
The high mount was made in more numbers and was the initial design.
Both designs were made at the same time in the late 60s to 1983.

Sounds like you have the high mount bell housing for a manual transmission.
If you have a low mount block (most common) that bell housing is not going to work well.

I may be able to come up with actual part numbers later.

Action

 

[Cardriver333]

Thanks! If it helps I've noticed there are starters with 3 bolt holes and ones with 2 bolt holes and my bell housing needs the 2 bolt pattern. If I remember correctly a few months ago I tried fitting a 2 bolt starter to it and the housing around the bendix came in contact with the flywheel and that is why I think the flywheel is too big. So the way I see it (correct me if I'm wrong) I can get a starter with an exposed bendix and make a bracket that puts it in the correct position or I would have to use a different flywheel or bellhousing or something like that. I just don't know what would be the best option.

 

[Action]

Yeah the 2 bolt and 3 bolt starters are used for the different bell housing configuration.

If it were me, I would make everything the same. And it all hinges on the engine bell housing configuration.
The manual transmission should fit because it is being bolted to the bell housing.
This makes the things to change or match are the bell housing and flywheel.

You (or a subsequent owner) will thank you if everything is consistent. Remembering what replacement parts you need may drive you nuts down the road. I have seen users post about the jig saw puzzle that they bought that was created by the previous owner(s). Parts

Which 200 six engine block do you have? I think it is the high mount starter.

Action

 

[Cardriver333]

The engine is blue and says C9DE 6015-B and forward from that 8K16. A Google search brought up someone on ford trucks .com asking what C9DE 6015-B was and they said C9 = 1969 D = Falcon/Maverick E = engine group. 6015 = "basic part number, which is the engine block

B is an engineering version - in this case, this was the second revision of the original design"

 

[Action]

All FLM engines from model year 1966 to the end of the 1970s would be blue. The shade does vary by year.
Using the engineering number to make an application is not very accurate. Meaning the design was made in 69 for Falcon and the engine could be used in Mustang, Comet, Fairlane and maybe a couple of others. But it is a start.
The consistency would be between high and low mounted starters, since you have a later 1960s or early 70s engine.

Where is the starter motor mounting hole?
Is it high or low?

Some other things I found -
If your starter attaches with THREE bolts to the bell housing you have an 8.5” clutch.
All 8.5” clutches use a “dog dish” 132 Tooth flywheel.
If your starter attaches with TWO bolts to the bell housing you have a 9” clutch.
All 9” clutches use a “flat” 136 Tooth flywheel.
In 1967 and beyond, most cars have the 9” bell/clutch combo.

Action

 

[Action]

Picture of low mount and high mount bell housings
The low mount may not be for six.

Action

 

[Cardriver333]

Oh yeah mine is low mount

 

[Action]

If your engine is a low mount, use a low mount bell housing, the flywheel & clutch for that.
And a six with low mount is less common. I believe this is called the Big Bell.
Which would use the 9" clutch.

Action

 

[Cardriver333]

Ok that's great help.

If your starter attaches with TWO bolts to the bell housing you have a 9” clutch.
All 9” clutches use a “flat” 136 Tooth flywheel.
In 1967 and beyond, most cars have the 9” bell/clutch combo.

Action

So with a manual I6 with low mount and a two bolt starter I would need the flat 136 tooth flywheel?

Also does it matter for the engine whether the flywheel is different?

 

[Action]

I have access to my parts catalogs. From the 65 to 72 parts Catalog.
.
The base part number for an engine block is -6010-
For 1965 to 1967 200 six cylinder the part number is C5DZ 6010 B (Noted with 7 main bearings and a 5/16" intermediate distributor shaft hole)
For 1968 and later 200 six cylinder the part number is D0DZ 6010 B
The above numbers make no difference as to model application. No engineering number was listed.
Both are hydraulic lifters

My guess is the first one is a high mount starter and the later one is a low mount starter. But this is just a guess.

Flywheel and ring gear. Flywheel base part number is -6375- and the ring gear is -6384-
There are 4 flywheels listed, with various amount of details

#1 C3DZ 6375 C includes 132 tooth ring gear and is 10 3/4"in diameter. Has 18 pressure plate bolt holes on a 9 3/8" diameter
#2 C3DZ 6375 B does not include a ring gear (Sorry I listed this one. It is for C4 automatic)
#3 C6DZ 6375 A includes 136 tooth ring gear and is 11 7/64"in diameter. Has 18 pressure plate bolt holes on a 10 1/4" diameter
#4 C6OZ 6375 C includes 157 tooth ring gear/ Diameter is not listed. Has 18 pressure plate bolt holes on a 11 3/8" diameter

I would suspect #3 and #4 are the same diameter.

Applications
#1 is for -
1965 B, F, X - 66 F, X and 67 X all with 3 or 4 speed manual transmission and a 8 1/2" clutch

#3 is for -
1966/67 B, F, X and 66 to 75 U and 67 X and 68 to 70 B, F, X all with 3 speed transmission and 9" clutch

#4 is for - 66/67 B and all Taxi applications with 200 six all will have 10 1/2" clutch

Some of the above flywheels are used in 170 CID engines

Vehicle codes for this period
B = Fairlane (Includes Falcon after 1970)
F = Mustang/Cougar
P = Maverick/Comet from 1971 and later
U = Bronco
X = Falcon only to 1970

Action

 

[Action]

There are 3 flywheel ring gears used for the period

C0DE 6384 A* - this is 132 teeth and 11.158" in diameter. For 8 1/2" clutch. 65 B, F, X and 66 F, X and 67 X
C2OZ 6384 B - this is 157 teeth and 13 1/4" in diameter. For HD clutch. 65/67 B & Taxi and 69 to 72 F & F applications
C6OZ 6384 A - this is 136 teeth and no diameter listed. For 9" clutch. 1966 to 1970 B, F, X, U and 1971 later P

*I suspect this part number to be incorrect.

Action

 

[Cardriver333]

So I think I'm gonna try putting the 157 tooth flywheel on. Are there any things I need to take in to consideration (like clutch size, where the bolts go to mount it...) things like that

 

[Action]

The question you are seeking answer for are:
Does 13 1/4" diameter ring gear fit in the block?
Can you find a 10 1/2" clutch and pressure plate? This is HD applications and may not be a readily available item.
In fact, I might find all of the parts first before placing an order

As far as assembly, the cutch and pressure plate will work in any position.
The bolts used to install are higher grade. If you do not have OE bolts get high grade bolts.

Action

 

[Cardriver333]

Ok, I bought a 157 tooth flywheel and starter and am now working on getting down to the flywheel. I took the driveshaft off and unbolted everything connected to the trans. I can not get the trans to separate from the bellhousing though. Do you have any idea how I might do that?

 

[Action]

Likely they are dis-similar metal. Aluminum and cast iron.
PB blaster or some other penetrating oil sprayed and then wait for it to penetrate for some time.

Post pictures of your progress while you are waiting for the oil to do it's job.

Action

 

[Cardriver333]

I just took the bellhousing off at the same time. Here's what it looks like right now

 

[Action]

Is that the flywheel without a ring gear?
If yes, does not look like it will fit with a ring gear
Action