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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
How terrible is it to run the car without the spout connector? It seriously runs so much better without it. I can't for the life of me figure out what the problem is. I tried the carb cleaner along the gaskets thing, but it runs so rough, i can't tell when the idle goes up or doesn't. I've been over and over every bit of the vacuum system that i've messed with in the last couple of weeks, and there's nothing wrong. Could the distributor be off a tooth or something?
 

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how were the O2 sensors when you put them in? it might not be a vacuum problem. or, have you played with the idle speed adjuster? or the TPS? are you getting a check engine light? it would be the orange. the red one is for when something is mechanically wrong(ie oil too low, coolant too high, ect)
 

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also, i just thought about, is the engine broken in? that would be a thing to consider. if it's the original cam for it, try 12 degrees BTDC. 10 might not be close enough
 

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It's my understanding that removing the SPOUT connector takes the PCM out of the picture and it can not control the ignition timing.

Do you have access to a timing light? Check your timing with the SPOUT connector out, and see what you got.

Did you follow all the tips in my vacuum leak tips.
Like check the PCV valve and grommet, or block off the vacuum brake booster?

Howto locate a vacuum leak
http://www.fordforumsonline.com/forum/engine-drivetrain/94-howto-how-locate-vacuum-leak.html#post423

HowTO use and interpret a vacuum guage
How to Use and Interpret a Vacuum Gauge

Some 5.0's had a problem with induction missfires caused by improper routing of the plug wires.
I'll find a link for you about that.
 

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It's my understanding that removing the SPOUT connector takes the PCM out of the picture and it can not control the ignition timing.

Do you have access to a timing light? Check your timing with the SPOUT connector out, and see what you got.

Did you follow all the tips in my vacuum leak tips.
Like check the PCV valve and grommet, or block off the vacuum brake booster?

Howto locate a vacuum leak
http://www.fordforumsonline.com/forum/engine-drivetrain/94-howto-how-locate-vacuum-leak.html#post423

HowTO use and interpret a vacuum guage
How to Use and Interpret a Vacuum Gauge

Some 5.0's had a problem with induction missfires caused by improper routing of the plug wires.
I'll find a link for you about that.
i should point out to you poppy, it's a 1990 mustang 5.0 HO in zephry skin.
also i already helped him with initial timing when we were at his house.
 

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Well, that makes a lot of sense. I was wondering about a carbed engine with a SPOUT connector :crazy:

IF your firing order is the same as that depiected in the diagram, then consider routing your wires as depicted. Otherwise you may get induction missfires, or crossfireing.

1983 Ford Bronco Diagrams picture | SuperMotors.net

Rough idle is often a dirty sticky IAC. did you try cleaning it?

How about pulling diagnostic codes?
Maybe a malfunctioning MAP sensor, or poor vacuum to it.
Your air filter is relatively clean too?
 

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Maybe a malfunctioning MAP sensor,
i thought that too, but since it has the MAF the MAP is just there for basically no reason
 

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i thought that too, but since it has the MAF the MAP is just there for basically no reason
Zephery,
Can you verify if it has MAF or MAP?
I'm not familar with the SHO engines, but the regular 5.0's in '90 had MAP.
It wouldn't have both.

Did you guys convert to a MAF system?
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
It does have MAF. The MAP sensor is there, but it doesn't even have a vacuum port. Just one for ambient air.

I'll definitely check my wire routing. It's fairly neat, but still haphazard.

Which direction is before TDC? Is that above or below the pointer? My dampener does not have the number scale on it, just a whiteout mark.

It also occurs to me that my old lower intake had a pretty serious layer of dirt on it and the injectors had quite a bit on them when i pulled them out, so it's possible one got some inside when i was wiping them off. Also, i never looked at my plugs after the engine was burning coolant. It seems hard to believe they would have been fouled so quickly; i never ran it for too long, but still a good thing to check.
 

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that could do it. also, i would look into going to that bone yard and picking up a new balancer, one with marks... or see if eric has one. that one would be a 50oz imbalance. from like late 70's to 2001(not sure on when they went to that for sure) the 460, and 351W had the same one. engine rotates to the right, so i'd assume advance would be to the right (from driver to passenger)
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Couple more answers: nothing is new enough to need breaking in. I believe the engine ha something like 150,000 miles on it.there's no check engine light. The air filter is fine. I've never done anything with the O2 sensors, but they got a nice bath of coolant recently. Good suggestions!
 

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I'm not sure, but perhaps a dirty MAF could give you a rolling idle. IF you choose to clean it there is MAF cleaner.

Maybe new O rings are in order for your injectors. Could be a source for a vacuum leak.

MAP stands for MANIFOLD air pressure. Sounds like you have a crazy system there.
EDIT: MAP = Manifold Absolute Pressure [/end edit]

BTW... I think haphazard wiring is ok. I think the problem occurs when they run parallel to each other and are too close to each other.
 

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in a MAF system, the MAP is useless. it becomes an air density sensor for ambient air.
it's like that on ALL ford MAF apps
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
The injectors did get new O-rings. Also the IAC has been cleaned, and the PCV valve is new. And there are many new gaskets.

I'm going to pick up an O2 sensor sockets and pull them out. it makes a lot of sense that it's a sensor, if it only runs like crap when the computer is controlling the timing. I'm also going to look at a stethoscope, if they're not ridiculous money and see if that might help me track down a possible vacuum leak if the O2 sensors is not the problem. I did also notice that my IAT was very black.
 

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I don't think that it makes sense that it is your O2 sensors.
IF you think so, try disconnecting them; see if that makes a difference.

Replacing them may not be a bad idea, just because that era sensor was only good for 60,000 miles IIRC.

EDIT: I'd go with the IAT before the O2 sensors. But that's just me.
 

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The sensor your are refering to as a Map sensor is actually a barometric pressure sensor.It is used to determine air pressure.Like sea level would have more pressure than say Pikes peak.If you want to check the O2 sensors, try disconnecting the sensors and tying in a half charged D battery.This will hold the input steady at about .7 volts.Also if you can find an old analog volt meter(needle and dial type) you can watch the O2 sensor swings in realtime,instead of trying to follow a digital readout. As far as your spout connector,removing it puts the ign at base timing at idle.It will still advance when the engine is rev'd.Removal of the spout was a factory fix for some Fords with pinging problems back in the early to mid 90's.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
The sensor your are refering to as a Map sensor is actually a barometric pressure sensor.It is used to determine air pressure.Like sea level would have more pressure than say Pikes peak.If you want to check the O2 sensors, try disconnecting the sensors and tying in a half charged D battery.This will hold the input steady at about .7 volts.Also if you can find an old analog volt meter(needle and dial type) you can watch the O2 sensor swings in realtime,instead of trying to follow a digital readout. As far as your spout connector,removing it puts the ign at base timing at idle.It will still advance when the engine is rev'd.Removal of the spout was a factory fix for some Fords with pinging problems back in the early to mid 90's.
That's pretty interesting. I guess I won't worry too much about driving it that way then.

It's getting new O2 sensors and a new IAT. I know it's sort of throwing parts at it, but this engine is old, and it's been through a lot. I'd like it to run as best it can. The previous owner had the courtesy to strip the threads on both O2 sensors for me, so they were a joy to get out. They ended up in about 20 pieces each. :biggrin5:
 

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wow
 

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Once you replace the IAT an dO2 sensors, you may find that the engine will run better with the SPOUT connected. That will allow the PCM to control the timing based on engine load and air density. You'll probably get better performance and mileage with it connected.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Oh, yeah. I'll only leave the spout connector out as a last resort.
 
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