[Falcooo95]

Hey,
I’m new here. Just sold a Datsun to purchase a falcon. Want to get into the American car scene.
while I am searching for falcon to buy what are some things I should be looking for?
i want 63,64,65. I plan on doing a 302 swap with disc brakes and nice suspension. I’m I way over my head here? Thank you.

 

[Action]

Welcome to the FFO!

There are a number of Falcon guys here.

When buying an older car, buy the best condition you can afford. Most of the time you will send more money on a lesser condition ride.
Rust can be a big issue as the design and manufacturing methods improved decades later.
It is possible to find a stock Falcon of that generation with a small block V8. Just not a 302 which was introduced in 1968.
If you remove stock parts, there may be some guys looking for those parts.

Others will reply too

Action

 

[Falcooo95]

Thanks for the reply. So just out of curiosity did any falcons come stock with 5 lugs? I would love to find a 289 falcon but man they are so rare.

 

[Action]

Early Falcon models came with six cylinder engines or an optional V8.
All six cylinder engine models were built for lighter construction and had 13" wheels and 4 lug hubs
All V8 versions had 14" wheels and 5 lug hubs, larger drum brakes and I believe shock tower braces, torque boxes and larger cross members. Plus bigger tires and springs

The V8 option started in 1963 and later models.
More Mercury Comets came with a V8

You stated above you are looking for a 63, 64 or 65. The 1963 Falcon is the last year of that generation. 1964 is the first year of the second generation.

One other thing you might want to understand. In 1959 the US economy took a dip. When it came out many people wanted a second car. Just not a full sized one. Cheverlot and Plymouth had small cars. Ford jumped in with Comet first, followed by Falcon. These cars were no frillls basic transportation and price was a factor. Know that even the heater was optional. Yeah you will find a lot of 4 lug examples because many more of those were built and that is what the public wanted.

Action

 

[Action]

Look for a Sprint as that was a sport submodel. More if not all of those would have a V8.
Here is a Ranchero
1964 Ford Falcon Las Vega, NV | Hemmings
Already modified
1964 Ford Falcon | eBay
1964 Ford Falcon | eBay

Action

 

[Falcooo95]

Thanks for the lesson! Ok so before I make my decision. All I know is I want the 5 lug for what I want to do which I feel like kind of limits me. I need to see one is person to be honest. Sprint, and Futura. I like the square bodies not gonna lie. I appreciate your help.

 

[Action]

If you like the square body, take the 1963 (1st gen 60 to 63) off your list. It is rounded.

The 1964 & 1965 (second gen) are the more squared off body style.

Many 6 cylinder Falcons have been modified for V8 with the 5 lug hubs. Some of those modified Falcons are more complete than others.
And stock 5 lug hub Falcons are rather limited in original sales because they were more expensive at thhe time and that was NOT the focus of the Falcon line. Sportier and faster were the focus of Mustang whch came out in the early months of 1964 as a 1965 model.

Action

 

[Falcooo95]

Sorry action. I mean like i dont really care for a sprint too much. I like futuras because of the square back.
Yea I know the mustang is the sports car but everyone has one.
how hard is a 4 to 5 lug swap in your opinion?

 

[Action]

Here is a 65 Sprint
1965 Ford Falcon | eBay

Some data for you.
The Ford warranty plate rivited to the door or door jamb looks like the attached.
The 11 digit serial number (It was called a VIN after 1980) has an engine code.
That engine code is the 5th charactor from the left.
It is possible to find a 260 V8 in a 1964 or a 289 in 1964 and later models
A "C" is a 289. The 289 was introduced in 1963
A "F" is a 260. The 260 was introduced in 1962 and was ended at the end of the 1964 model run

Action

 

[Action]

..... how hard is a 4 to 5 lug swap in your opinion?

Don't know, never done one. Never owned a Falcon. In addition to that, I do not care to modify vehicles that much.

In my ignorant opinion, the front should not be too difficult. It is the rear that is the issue.
You will need a new rear axle or axle shafts.
And if you are changing hubs and brakes from a 6 to an 8, there other things (IMO) that should be done as well.
New springs, front and rear
New shock tower braces
Other suspension items like lower control arm and/or bushings
Larger radiator
Change to alternator if you get a 64
Replace existing exhaust and go to a dual exhaust system
Beefing up some of the unibody. (I would want to research this. Or someone else may chip in)
The engine chang will require a driveline chnage. May require a transmission chnage.

A 6 cylinder Falcon was not designed to take long term stress of a V8. Especially a newer V8 (302) that had more punch than a late 1960s 302.

Action

 

[2thpic]

Some have done the 4 lug to 5 lug conversion. I have not, my falcon is still a 4 lug. I think the only advantage of a 5 vs a 4 is finding rims. Tons of 5 lug rims out there and about 4 different styles for 4 lugs, well more than that but not much more.
As fare as the years you are looking at do some research on aftermarket parts that you can get for it. like dash, door panels, windshield, fenders and such. Mine is a 67 and the only year that had it's one style front fenders. Dash was a 2yr process to find one. There are other parts and stuff that are not made for that year, so it's a scavenger hunt for them hard to find parts.

o yea welcome to the family

 

[Falcooo95]

So the only thing stoping me from pulling the trigger on a falcon is the brakes. I want disc brakes because I want to make a bad ass falcon.
302
T5
Bigger rear end
Strong front end
Interior i want to keep as original as I can. I’m coming from a Datsun 620 I restored and I honestly learned I wanna go fast but have a nice cruiser on the weekends.

 

[mainsoda]

I changed the front brakes on my 68 in less than 2 minutes, heh heh, sort of. It was really easy and actually quite fun. (64's are the best looking falcons IMHO)

My quick change video

 

[Falcooo95]

I’m just saying the ford community is awesome so far you guys are giving me a lot information. Thank you!

 

[2thpic]

YEA, Mainsoda use to be on Ricky Bobby's pit crew back in the day.

 

[Action]

The minute and a half 4 piston disc!

You should see him color coat a ride.

Action

 

[Falcooo95]

So I’ve been doing some research. Seriously what’s kind of stopping me is understanding what is needed to do a V8 swap before I got by a 302 to rebuild.
What I found so far 1963 falcon 4 lug considering this year
1. They make kits 4-5 lug but the lugs are on the rotor. Does this cause more issues, I’ve never actually seen this before.
2.V8 swap requires a better suspension. I found Scott Drake makes V8 Mustang spindles that fit the falcon and fit for a disc brake conversion. What would you all recommend for suspension upgrade on a 63 falcon? I’m talking bars, arms, coils, steering. trying to create an estimate before I just throw a V8 in it.
I found a patina 63 falcon that really caught my eye.

 

[Action]

Most vehicles of the era used a hub and rotor as one assembly. A separate rotor from the hub is a more modern design.
I think this is the answer to your #1 item.

Action

 

[ms fowler]

Falcoo95--Welcome to the forum.
Action has pretty much steered you right. 6 cyl cars were 4 lug and 9" drums. V8s got 5lugs and 10"drums,Car reviews of the period said that V8s got Fairlane suspension pieces and brakes.
Underbody did not change much 1960-1965 except for the parts that were strengthened or added. Convertibles have extra beef added in a a few places to try to replace the rigidity lost by removing the top. Even so convertibles are not known for their rigidity. Cowl shake is present in moderate amounts. A sedan or hartop will be more rigid.\
Sprint is a sub-variant of Futura. All Sprints are Futuras, but not all Futuras are Sprints. There might have been a few 1963 Sprint 6 cyl cars, but in general all later Sprints are V8--Windsor small block--mostly 260 with 2 bbl. 1965 added the 289. Anywhere a 260 is bolted in, a 302 fill fit.
Rust is the enemy. Ford learned a lot in the years between Falcon's introduction and Mustang----and Mustangs rust badly, too.
Here is an interesting tidbit for (new) Ford lovers--Ford has introduced 3 new models over the years that each set the record as the most sucessfull new car model introduction based on sales. First was the Model A. Second was the Falcon--it was the right car at the righ time-they sold MILLIONS of them. The third most sucessful new car was, of course, the Mustang ( largely based on a Falcon floor pan and running gear. Also when you consider the sicess of the Falcon, remember that it come right on the heels of the Edsel fiasco where FoMoCo .lost hundreds of Millions of dollars. Yet, HFII gave the go ahead and allowed the falcon to be born.
Some books that will help you---FALCON-the New-Sozed FORD, by Ray Miller first printing 1982 Library of Congress # 82-090194. This is largely a picture book covering 1960-1970 1/2 Model years but mostly 1960-1965. There is some history and some reprints of early ads, but mostly, Mr. Miller walks around each car with his camera and photgraphs EVERYTHING and shows the changes over the years. Not much on "How To" hot rod a Falcon, or what parts fit, but a good history of how Ford made them.
A Factory Shop manual is a must-have for the approriate year.
I am a great fan of the 2 volume Ford parts Manuals--Iluustrations and Text
"Most" of what works on early Mustangs, as far as brakes, axles, springs etc, also works on Falcons.
Good luck with your project--You are at the best part--looking and investigating costs almost nothing. A rust-free car from the SW is always a better starting point than a salt-region rusty wreck.
Where are you located?
There were 435, 676 Falcons produced in 1960 and 471, 191 in 1961 and 396, 129 in 1962---all these were 6 cylinders
In 1963 there were 265,518, but Ford did not record how many were 6 cyls and how many were 8s.
In 1964, the numbers are 130,103 of which18,108 were SPrints and had to be V8s, but Ford did not record how many others might have be V8s
In 1965 total production was 171, 442, but Sprint had become only a trim option at that point.
You are looking for a rare car! Good Luck ( You only need to find ONE.)

 

[Falcooo95]

Falcoo95--Welcome to the forum.
Action has pretty much steered you right. 6 cyl cars were 4 lug and 9" drums. V8s got 5lugs and 10"drums,Car reviews of the period said that V8s got Fairlane suspension pieces and brakes.
Underbody did not change much 1960-1965 except for the parts that were strengthened or added. Convertibles have extra beef added in a a few places to try to replace the rigidity lost by removing the top. Even so convertibles are not known for their rigidity. Cowl shake is present in moderate amounts. A sedan or hartop will be more rigid.\
Sprint is a sub-variant of Futura. All Sprints are Futuras, but not all Futuras are Sprints. There might have been a few 1963 Sprint 6 cyl cars, but in general all later Sprints are V8--Windsor small block--mostly 260 with 2 bbl. 1965 added the 289. Anywhere a 260 is bolted in, a 302 fill fit.
Rust is the enemy. Ford learned a lot in the years between Falcon's introduction and Mustang----and Mustangs rust badly, too.
Here is an interesting tidbit for (new) Ford lovers--Ford has introduced 3 new models over the years that each set the record as the most sucessfull new car model introduction based on sales. First was the Model A. Second was the Falcon--it was the right car at the righ time-they sold MILLIONS of them. The third most sucessful new car was, of course, the Mustang ( largely based on a Falcon floor pan and running gear. Also when you consider the sicess of the Falcon, remember that it come right on the heels of the Edsel fiasco where FoMoCo .lost hundreds of Millions of dollars. Yet, HFII gave the go ahead and allowed the falcon to be born.
Some books that will help you---FALCON-the New-Sozed FORD, by Ray Miller first printing 1982 Library of Congress # 82-090194. This is largely a picture book covering 1960-1970 1/2 Model years but mostly 1960-1965. There is some history and some reprints of early ads, but mostly, Mr. Miller walks around each car with his camera and photgraphs EVERYTHING and shows the changes over the years. Not much on "How To" hot rod a Falcon, or what parts fit, but a good history of how Ford made them.
A Factory Shop manual is a must-have for the approriate year.
I am a great fan of the 2 volume Ford parts Manuals--Iluustrations and Text
"Most" of what works on early Mustangs, as far as brakes, axles, springs etc, also works on Falcons.
Good luck with your project--You are at the best part--looking and investigating costs almost nothing. A rust-free car from the SW is always a better starting point than a salt-region rusty wreck.
Where are you located?
There were 435, 676 Falcons produced in 1960 and 471, 191 in 1961 and 396, 129 in 1962---all these were 6 cylinders
In 1963 there were 265,518, but Ford did not record how many were 6 cyls and how many were 8s.
In 1964, the numbers are 130,103 of which18,108 were SPrints and had to be V8s, but Ford did not record how many others might have be V8s
In 1965 total production was 171, 442, but Sprint had become only a trim option at that point.
You are looking for a rare car! Good Luck ( You only need to find ONE.)

Thank you for the information! I actually just bought a nice patina 63 futura. I am excited to start doing thing to it I think I am definitely starting on making it safe coilovers, steering and disc conversion with bigger tires and wheels